Question / Help Windows 8 CLOCK_WATCHDOG_TIMEOUT while streaming?

soladis66

New Member
Hi,

I just started streaming again yesterday, and I encountered a few problems at first but was able to fix them on my own, but while I stream now I can get about 6-8 minutes into streaming and then I get a BSoD with the error of CLOCK_WATCHDOG_TIMEOUT. And I already know that this is due to my CPU locking up/hanging, and I already know it is due to OBS not communicating correcting with the CPU. If by any chance would anyone know how to fix this?

Spec:
OS: Windows 8 Pro 64-bit
CPU: Phenom II x4 3.5GHz (OC to 3.9GHz)
RAM: 8GB Patriot Memory 9-9-9-24 1333MHz
Motherboard: Asus M5A88-M (Out of date, I know)
HDD: 500GB 7200RPM 64MB Cache

If you need anymore information from me, just let me know I will provide what ever you need. (Not my SSN).

Thank you,
Soladis
 

Kharay

Member
Personally, I'm more inclined to wonder if that OC might possibly be unstable. Have you tried it without the OC? Because from what I found about this particular BSOD in 80% of the cases it is purely hardware related.

Either a faulty core and/or an unstable OC.

So:
  • Remove the OC
  • Update any and all drivers to their latest stable build, this includes but is not limited to possible software drivers such as Avast, Daemon Tools, etc.
  • Flash the BIOS to the latest stable build.
If the problem persists after that, you may actually have a faulty CPU on your hands.
 

soladis66

New Member
I've been using this OC for a while now, no crashes or anything with it. Only when I stream it locks up and BSoDs me. And if I use it at base clock speed I get a major reduction in my FPS for my games.
 

Kharay

Member
soladis66 said:
I've been using this OC for a while now, no crashes or anything with it. Only when I stream it locks up and BSoDs me. And if I use it at base clock speed I get a major reduction in my FPS for my games.
The fact the stream triggers the BSOD does not mean the stream is the cause of the BSOD. That is a very important distinction to make. And see my edit(s).

As far as FPS drops go -- There are better, more stable ways to get an FPS improvement in-game. Specifically, simply tone the game's graphics down a bit. As you know yourself, your hardware is not exactly state-of-the-art. This has to come at a consequence, the consequence being that you simply can't get away with running a game at its maximum settings. Which games are we talking about here?
 

soladis66

New Member
League of Legends, Dirt 3, Audiosurf, etc. I can normally run these games at 100+fps on high settings. Even while streaming. But you're right it may be my cpu failing, because I notice while I play league that my fps randomly drops and then picks back up, and it skips a frame as well.
 

Lain

Forum Admin
Lain
Forum Moderator
Developer
soladis66 said:
and I already know it is due to OBS not communicating correcting with the CPU.

If OBS were "not communicating correctly with the CPU", as in just executing bad machine code or something, the app would crash. It would not cause a blue screen of death, as OBS runs no kernel code. Only kernel code can cause a BSOD. They cannot be directly caused by OBS, because OBS is a user level program. Sigh, sadly, as a developer, when I try to explain to the user the concept of blue screens of death, they tend to ignore me. Listen, I understand that you don't wish to be told that you are incorrect, but unfortunately in this case you are indeed incorrect.

Let me yet again go into the concepts of how operating systems work. An operating system typically has two operating levels, kernel level, and user level. The kernel comprises of the actual kernel, drivers, and everything that needs to access devices and the system directly. When the kernel crashes, this causes a blue screen of death. This is typically caused by either a bug in kernel code or instabilities or bugs in hardware, or a combination. A blue screen of death can only happen in kernel code, which OBS does not have.

Then there's user space. User space is for user programs, such as OBS, your web browsers, games, and everthing that is run by a user. In user space, when something is not executed correctly, or doesn't work right, it can safely be recovered and simply crashes the program itself. A user space program cannot directly crash the kernel, because it does not execute kernel code. It can increase system instability, especially in the case of stressing out your CPU, by, say, running a heavy-duty encoder and game at the same time, but it cannot cause a blue screen of death directly. Of course, a user space program does communicate with the kernel, but only the kernel code can cause a blue screen of death. This is simply a fact. Again, OBS cannot directly cause a BSOD.

What people don't realize is they play their game and stream at the same time, both of which are two CPU/GPU intensive activities going at the same exact time on the same CPU/GPU. You are probably going to use quite a bit more CPU/GPU while streaming a game than you will any other activity, so it will bring out the possibility of instabilities with overclocks. It's like running multiple games at once, only encoding typically takes even more CPU power. It stresses the CPU quite a bit.

I know you'll probably just ignore everything I've written because you don't want to be told this, but you cannot make such statements without at least a proper citation to back up such a claim. "Only happens while streaming" does not equal "Proof that OBS is not communicating with the CPU properly". If it were "not communicating with the CPU properly", would that mean an incorrect instruction was executed? If that were the case, all it would do is just cause the application itself to crash, not the kernel. Your statement unfortunately has no basis in actual computer science.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_screen_of_death for more information. Specifically, the part where it says "BSoDs can be caused by poorly written device drivers or malfunctioning hardware, such as faulty memory, power supply issues, overheating of components, or hardware running beyond its specification limits"
 

Kharay

Member
You see, this particular BSOD is quite low level. On either a hardware level or a driver level. OBS does not operate at that low level, not even remotely. Consequently, whereas it may trigger the event there really is no conceivable way in which it is the cause of the event.

Anyhow, have you tried it yet without the OC? OC-ing is quite complex actually, you may simply have an OC going that is borderline stable; almost stable but not quite. Keep an eye on this situation. Would be a shame to burn out your CPU before having been able to replace it.
 

soladis66

New Member
Okay Jim, I read all of what your wrote and understand it all, but can you explain why I only receive this Blue Screen while I stream, and no other time?

Kharay, I will try it at base clock speed, but I've been using this OC for a while now with no failures or anything.
 

Lain

Forum Admin
Lain
Forum Moderator
Developer
I do not know for sure why you're getting it, I cannot make any solid conclusions, however streaming is very CPU intensive, and you are playing a game and streaming on top of that. You're stressing your CPU much more when doing this than you are doing anything else. My suspicion is that because of the increased usage, it's bringing out instability with your system that otherwise wouldn't occur, especially along with the fact that you stated that you are overclocking.

(But I stated these things multiple times in my previous post so I'm going to assume you grazed over it)
 

Kharay

Member
soladis66 said:
Okay Jim, I read all of what your wrote and understand it all, but can you explain why I only receive this Blue Screen while I stream, and no other time?
Cause and effect. As I said, the situation may be borderline stable. Adding a stream to the equation may simply be... too much for the CPU to handle.

Likely, the BSOD would also start occurring if, for example, you would run something like Prime95 or simply start piling processes on top of processes on top of processes. Taxing the CPU hard. You see, even though OBS actually is fairly well optimized, it still is quite a taxing task for your PC to perform; running a game and doing a real-time encode simultaneously.

I cannot stress this enough; OBS really is not the cause, only the trigger.
 

soladis66

New Member
Yes I understand the consequences of streaming, I've been doing it for a couple years now. And I do understand that my CPU is old now, and it may be deteriorating on it's own because of my Over Clocking. I will try switching out my CPUs later today and see if that will help my problem.
 

soladis66

New Member
Okay, I reduced my CPU to base clock speed, and so far no BSoDs while streaming, I will check back in later if I crash again.
 

Krazy

Town drunk
No overclock is ever to be considered stable until it has passed stress tests like Prime95.
 
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