Question / Help The Complete Newbie: an idiot's guide wanted

[Flamboro]

Hello there, my name is William. Recently, I registered an account on Twitch.tv in the hope that I'll be able to broadcast speedruns. I've made one attempt to broadcast, on a previous account, but the stream's video either froze or churned images out at a snail's pace. OBS would also flash High CPU encoding warnings in the bottom-left corner. Here's some basic information about the OBS software and my laptop:

Open Broadcaster Software v0.651b

Lenovo G580 Laptop

• Processor: Intel(R) Premium(R) CPU B960 @ 2.20GHz
• Installed memory (RAM): 6.00GB (5.85GB usable)
• System type: 64-bit Operating System, x64-based processor

I am at a complete loss and I think it'll be best, for efficiency's sake, if you treat me as if I'm an idiot. Baby steps is all I can handle. Am I able to produce a stream of an acceptable quality with my laptop? What settings should I use on OBS? Do I need to provide any more information?

Profile: http://www.twitch.tv/Flamboro
_______________________________________

Log URL (28th March 2015): https://gist.github.com/6e117fa06b84922efa71

 

[dping]

Hello there, my name is William. Recently, I registered an account on Twitch.tv in the hope that I'll be able to broadcast speedruns. I've made one attempt to broadcast, on a previous account, but the stream's video either froze or churned images out at a snail's pace. OBS would also flash High CPU encoding warnings in the bottom-left corner. Here's some basic information about the OBS software and my laptop:

Open Broadcaster Software v0.651b

Lenovo G580 Laptop

• Processor: Intel(R) Premium(R) CPU B960 @ 2.20GHz
• Installed memory (RAM): 6.00GB (5.85GB usable)
• System type: 64-bit Operating System, x64-based processor

I am at a complete loss and I think it'll be best, for efficiency's sake, if you treat me as if I'm an idiot. Baby steps is all I can handle. Am I able to produce a stream of an acceptable quality with my laptop? What settings should I use on OBS? Do you I need to provide any more information?

Profile: http://www.twitch.tv/Flamboro
_______________________________________

Log URL (28th March 2015): https://gist.github.com/6e117fa06b84922efa71

your x264 settings are to high for your CPU. either downscale further to maybe 908x512p @30fps or use quicksync

 

[Flamboro]

Thank you for responding, dping. Alright, I'll give it a tweak and then another crack.

 

[Flamboro]

Right, I downscaled to 910x512 and the encoding is still too high, apparently, and a lot of dropped frames were accumulated. Should I reduce it further? Here is the log file from the streaming test I just performed:

Most recent Log URL (26th April 2015): https://gist.github.com/8be8e3ce30656f2f0138

OBS Log Analyzer

Wireless detected

You appear to be streaming over a wireless connection. While this can be OK, keep in mind that interference from other radio sources or obstacles can cause your connection to momentarily stall, resulting in dropped frames or disconnects. A wired connection is strongly recommended for a reliable stream.

Possible slow server

The server you are streaming to (rtmp://live-lhr.twitch.tv/app) took 881 ms to connect. This may mean your connection or the server is slow, or the server is far away from you. If you are using twitch.tv, you may want to try using JTVPing to find an optimal server.

Skipped frames detected

The video encoder is unable to encode your frames in realtime, causing skipped frames (the video output will appear frozen). This is often caused by running at too high of a resolution / FPS combination for your CPU. Try lowering your resolution and/or FPS. If you have changed the x264 preset, put it back to default (veryfast).

See https://obsproject.com/forum/thread...ing-too-long-to-encode-read-this-first.23334/ for more details on how to fix this problem.

Dropped frames detected

36% of your frames were dropped due to poor network conditions. Frames are dropped when data can not be sent fast enough to the server you have selected. This is caused by trying to stream at too high of a bitrate, or by the streaming server you selected not being able to accept the data at the rate you are sending.

Try switching servers, especially if you are using twitch.tv. As a test, you could also try streaming to a different provider to check whether the problem is on your end or not.

Note that some ISPs will temporarily increase your upload speed at the start of a transfer - if you only start to drop frames after 30 - 60 seconds, your ISP is likely doing this and you will need to use a lower bitrate.

Finally, if you are using a wireless connection, keep in mind that interference from other radio sources can cause your connection to stutter and drop frames. A wired connection is strongly recommended when streaming.

See https://obsproject.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=8870 for more advice on how to fix dropped frames.

Bad server selected

The server you are streaming to (rtmp://live-lhr.twitch.tv/app) took a very long time to connect. This could be due to a poor connection, server problems or streaming to a server that is a long distance away from you. Streaming to servers that are closer to you often results in the best results. If you are using twitch.tv, try using JTVPing to find an optimal server.

5 issues found (3 major, 2 minor).

 

[dping]

Right, I downscaled to 910x512 and the encoding is still too high, apparently, and a lot of dropped frames were accumulated. Should I reduce it further? Here is the log file from the streaming test I just performed:

Most recent Log URL (26th April 2015): https://gist.github.com/8be8e3ce30656f2f0138

Sorry, I didn't do a great job of looking through your log, damn multitasking :P
Leave the downscaling where its at for the moment...

Scene buffering time set to 400

Set scene buffering to 700ms

Interface: Qualcomm Atheros AR9485WB-EG Wireless Network Adapter (802.11, 97 mbps)

As your analyzer said, you shouldn't stream over wireless, recommend you switch to a wired connection of possible. Streaming wireless is like sharing a network cable with every other wireless device on your network, and also means that the connection steadiness that streaming needs isn't there.

RTMPPublisher::SocketLoop: Stalled for 1776 ms to write
137512 bytes (buffer: 0 / 140288), unstable connection?

download the below tool and set it for your region then test, make sure you aren't doing anything on the network when you do this test. after the test post a screen shot of the results and post it here.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tech-support/478845-twitchtest-twitch-bandwidth-tester



After the above results, I'll advise you further on what can be done.

 

[Flamboro]

As per your instruction, I've left the resolution downscale (910x512) as it is and I've increased the scene buffering time to 700ms. I have not switched to a wired connection yet. I'll try to sort that out soon. Here is the screenshot from the Twitch Bandwidth Test:

 

[D2ultima]

Oh my. I'm sorry to break it to you dude, but you don't appear to have enough bandwidth neither a strong enough processor to make that low bandwidth work for most games out there. You very much appear to need both a new PC as well as a faster internet connection to have any kind of good time streaming.

 

[Flamboro]

Oh my. I'm sorry to break it to you dude, but you don't appear to have enough bandwidth neither a strong enough processor to make that low bandwidth work for most games out there. You very much appear to need both a new PC as well as a faster internet connection to have any kind of good time streaming.

Thank you. No need to apologise, it's something I need to know. I've been making plans to buy a new laptop for awhile. Is there a laptop that has a powerful enough processor? I'll also try downloading the software on my laptop onto the desktop PC that's in the house, just to see how that turns out on stream.

 

[D2ultima]

There are laptops, but your main thing is a budget. If you give me one, I'll point you to the best laptop to stream with. Make sure you list the country you are in too! Converting the money to USD if you're in England etc is useless as even after conversion, other countries pay more.

 

[dping]

Thank you. No need to apologise, it's something I need to know. I've been making plans to buy a new laptop for awhile. Is there a laptop that has a powerful enough processor? I'll also try downloading the software on my laptop onto the desktop PC that's in the house, just to see how that turns out on stream.

with streaming, upload speed and the CPU are the two most important factors. Even with a low end cpu you can get out a decent stream as long as you have the upload speed from your ISP, especially with a hardware encoder, I will get into that in a bit..

you have neither. you have about 500kbps (500 bitrate) and a mobile dual core.

Recommended to get between 3Mbps-5Mbps from your ISP. now that doesn't mean that you should stream at 3Mbps (3000bitrate), it just means you have it so that your median from you ISP will stay above your stream speed, which is also why wireless is not recommended.

Now there is a hardware encoder on your CPU called quicksync, it will take the load off your dual core CPU and put the load on your GPU instead. which should help a lot, but, you will have some quality loss with hardware encoders. x264 (software encoders) will always top every other method, but is very cpu intensive.


TL;DR, if you spring for a better upload speed, 3Mbps minimum (5 recommended), you can use quicksync to stream at 720@30fps but you will need to sustain 3Mbps which is why I am recommending to get 5MBps.

 

[Flamboro]

There are laptops, but your main thing is a budget. If you give me one, I'll point you to the best laptop to stream with. Make sure you list the country you are in too! Converting the money to USD if you're in England etc is useless as even after conversion, other countries pay more.

I live in England. If I may, I would like to divide the prospective budget into three ranges:

1. £0-£500
2. £500-£1000
3. £1000-£2000

If it's not too inconvenient, would you please find the best laptop within each price range? Thank you very much for helping me with this.

with streaming, upload speed and the CPU are the two most important factors. Even with a low end cpu you can get out a decent stream as long as you have the upload speed from your ISP, especially with a hardware encoder, I will get into that in a bit..

you have neither. you have about 500kbps (500 bitrate) and a mobile dual core.

Recommended to get between 3Mbps-5Mbps from your ISP. now that doesn't mean that you should stream at 3Mbps (3000bitrate), it just means you have it so that your median from you ISP will stay above your stream speed, which is also why wireless is not recommended.

Now there is a hardware encoder on your CPU called quicksync, it will take the load off your dual core CPU and put the load on your GPU instead. which should help a lot, but, you will have some quality loss with hardware encoders. x264 (software encoders) will always top every other method, but is very cpu intensive.


TL;DR, if you spring for a better upload speed, 3Mbps minimum (5 recommended), you can use quicksync to stream at 720@30fps but you will need to sustain 3Mbps which is why I am recommending to get 5MBps.

Thank you very much for this. I'll bear that in mind.

 

[D2ultima]

I live in England. If I may, I would like to divide the prospective budget into three ranges:

1. £0-£500
2. £500-£1000
3. £1000-£2000

If it's not too inconvenient, would you please find the best laptop within each price range? Thank you very much for helping me with this.

1. Doesn't really exist. At least not new. I couldn't recommend anything in that range that would make streaming anything other than a living hell.
2 - http://mysn.co.uk/shop/xmg-a305-gaminglaptop.html this is a decent machine, but it's a 13". The 4710MQ is the CPU you should get, and I suggest 2 x 8GB of RAM. You have a little extra cash for an SSD if you want. You will also need to repaste the CPU with better paste.
3 - http://mysn.co.uk/shop/xmg-u705-gaminglaptop.html this is basically the cream of the crop. 4790K desktop CPU and the same 16GB of RAM config. You can get a SSD if it's important. The 970M might be the GPU you want to take instead of the 965M, if you want to get best value. Or you could deck it out fully with the 980M; might still be in-budget.

For each model I listed, you should take the HGST Travelstar 7K1000 (1TB 7200RPM) HDD instead of the default, unless you are willing to go SSD only storage. You should also take the intel 7260ac or 7265ac wifi card instead of the default one.

 

[Flamboro]

1. Doesn't really exist. At least not new. I couldn't recommend anything in that range that would make streaming anything other than a living hell.
2 - http://mysn.co.uk/shop/xmg-a305-gaminglaptop.html this is a decent machine, but it's a 13". The 4710MQ is the CPU you should get, and I suggest 2 x 8GB of RAM. You have a little extra cash for an SSD if you want. You will also need to repaste the CPU with better paste.
3 - http://mysn.co.uk/shop/xmg-u705-gaminglaptop.html this is basically the cream of the crop. 4790K desktop CPU and the same 16GB of RAM config. You can get a SSD if it's important. The 970M might be the GPU you want to take instead of the 965M, if you want to get best value. Or you could deck it out fully with the 980M; might still be in-budget.

For each model I listed, you should take the HGST Travelstar 7K1000 (1TB 7200RPM) HDD instead of the default, unless you are willing to go SSD only storage. You should also take the intel 7260ac or 7265ac wifi card instead of the default one.

Thank you. Do any of the MacBook Pro laptops offer enough power?

https://www.apple.com/uk/macbook-pro/

 

[D2ultima]

Thank you. Do any of the MacBook Pro laptops offer enough power?

https://www.apple.com/uk/macbook-pro/

The two 15" MBPs seem to have enough CPU... the 4702HQ and the 4710HQ appear to be their chips.

HOWEVER. Please be wary: they are *NOT* designed for any sort of heavy load. Not only are the HQ chips exceedingly TDP limited (and you will not be able to undervolt them and squeeze out more speed per watt or make them produce less heat), but the macbooks are far too thin to produce any kind of good cooling, and their notebooks, regardless of the "pro" at the end or WHATEVER apple may think you can do with them, are designed for the absolute minimum of loads. Any attempt to produce any sort of decent x264 compression on the notebook *WILL* cause it to overheat, no matter what you do.

For example proof, here's a macbook pro's inside:

Spoiler

And here's a P750ZM's inside:

Spoiler

Note the difference in the heatsinks.