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OBS Looses Sound Source - new Allen & Heath CQ18T Mixer
- Thread starter derevus
- Start date
Happens to me a lot these days too in Windows 11. My new belief is that it is due to the computer being a component weak one that loses audio interactions easily because its primary concern is Graphics but it has no GPU or a weak low grade GPU.
Does yours also go all static after a minute (when it doesn't completely drop out, that is)? This static problem comes and goes, and the audio starts beautiful but becomes mush and static. Very common issue that can be solved (only for another minute then it happens again) by changing the Audio device's buffer size.
Because this is my problem these days on one of my computers which it would be nice if it played well with my audio interface, but it
just will not.
I have experienced this in the past with laptops and Windows 10, but they weren't as bad as this Mini PC I have been attempting to use for music making with VST instruments, which the audio drops and goes static at around 20 seconds, sometimes as much as a minute of beautiful high grade audio before dropping the interface or going to mush and static audio. Though the static is the main problem, It also completely drops my interface quite often (so it goes to dead air). It doesn't have the same problem with the audio on the Windows default using Realtek speaker/headpone out, that works fine. Just with the interface.
I would bet you wouldn't need to reboot OBS to get it back but just go into the properties of the audio source, de select that source you use, (by cliicking default, or Windows or something else) then re select it, and it would come back on. Does that work?
If so I believe you have the same problem of mine, which is because the computer is weak and the USB interface gets dropped constantly.
Test the issue in other applications if you can. What DAW do you use? If you can, test a VST instrument on your desktop, and monitor the audio thru your USB connected mixer to its headphone out, does the audio drop out after a minute or go to static? This can be tested with any VSTi instrument you can put on your desktop and run, selecting your mixer as an ASIO output. Try it and listen if it gets the same result OBS gets.
Frustrating because these low quality computers could be great to make music on but Windows is not designed to prioritize audio (this is what I think the problem is) and they will never be working no matter what you do. I would be open to options to fix the problem but I don't believe this static from interface can be fixed because I have never seen it fixed in 6 years of experiencing it since I first used a Ryzen laptop (Radeon 580 grapics) and had the issues in 2018 and never found any way to fix it. I ran a system process rainmeter skin for most of 2018 and 2019, and found that Microsoft Malware MsMpengine process would trigger the static to come in, which would require the old Fast Track Ultra interface to be power cycled to be fixed.
I think I had similar problems on my NVIDIA 960 and 1060 laptops but it's hard to remember if they were exactly the same.
OK but at least this isn't my main audio computer which has a large Gigabyte RTX GPU and works rock steady for audio all the time.
Does yours also go all static after a minute (when it doesn't completely drop out, that is)? This static problem comes and goes, and the audio starts beautiful but becomes mush and static. Very common issue that can be solved (only for another minute then it happens again) by changing the Audio device's buffer size.
Because this is my problem these days on one of my computers which it would be nice if it played well with my audio interface, but it
just will not.
I have experienced this in the past with laptops and Windows 10, but they weren't as bad as this Mini PC I have been attempting to use for music making with VST instruments, which the audio drops and goes static at around 20 seconds, sometimes as much as a minute of beautiful high grade audio before dropping the interface or going to mush and static audio. Though the static is the main problem, It also completely drops my interface quite often (so it goes to dead air). It doesn't have the same problem with the audio on the Windows default using Realtek speaker/headpone out, that works fine. Just with the interface.
I would bet you wouldn't need to reboot OBS to get it back but just go into the properties of the audio source, de select that source you use, (by cliicking default, or Windows or something else) then re select it, and it would come back on. Does that work?
If so I believe you have the same problem of mine, which is because the computer is weak and the USB interface gets dropped constantly.
Test the issue in other applications if you can. What DAW do you use? If you can, test a VST instrument on your desktop, and monitor the audio thru your USB connected mixer to its headphone out, does the audio drop out after a minute or go to static? This can be tested with any VSTi instrument you can put on your desktop and run, selecting your mixer as an ASIO output. Try it and listen if it gets the same result OBS gets.
Frustrating because these low quality computers could be great to make music on but Windows is not designed to prioritize audio (this is what I think the problem is) and they will never be working no matter what you do. I would be open to options to fix the problem but I don't believe this static from interface can be fixed because I have never seen it fixed in 6 years of experiencing it since I first used a Ryzen laptop (Radeon 580 grapics) and had the issues in 2018 and never found any way to fix it. I ran a system process rainmeter skin for most of 2018 and 2019, and found that Microsoft Malware MsMpengine process would trigger the static to come in, which would require the old Fast Track Ultra interface to be power cycled to be fixed.
I think I had similar problems on my NVIDIA 960 and 1060 laptops but it's hard to remember if they were exactly the same.
OK but at least this isn't my main audio computer which has a large Gigabyte RTX GPU and works rock steady for audio all the time.
Thanks for the suggestion. I will get the specs off the machine. It is a high end gaming laptop but I think you may be right on the windows and audio issue. We think it may also be related to the length of the USB cord coming from the mixer and the fact that the usb cable comes into a hub rather than a dedicated usb port.Happens to me a lot these days too in Windows 11. My new belief is that it is due to the computer being a component weak one that loses audio interactions easily because its primary concern is Graphics but it has no GPU or a weak low grade GPU.
Does yours also go all static after a minute (when it doesn't completely drop out, that is)? This static problem comes and goes, and the audio starts beautiful but becomes mush and static. Very common issue that can be solved (only for another minute then it happens again) by changing the Audio device's buffer size.
Because this is my problem these days on one of my computers which it would be nice if it played well with my audio interface, but it
just will not.
I have experienced this in the past with laptops and Windows 10, but they weren't as bad as this Mini PC I have been attempting to use for music making with VST instruments, which the audio drops and goes static at around 20 seconds, sometimes as much as a minute of beautiful high grade audio before dropping the interface or going to mush and static audio. Though the static is the main problem, It also completely drops my interface quite often (so it goes to dead air). It doesn't have the same problem with the audio on the Windows default using Realtek speaker/headpone out, that works fine. Just with the interface.
I would bet you wouldn't need to reboot OBS to get it back but just go into the properties of the audio source, de select that source you use, (by cliicking default, or Windows or something else) then re select it, and it would come back on. Does that work?
If so I believe you have the same problem of mine, which is because the computer is weak and the USB interface gets dropped constantly.
Test the issue in other applications if you can. What DAW do you use? If you can, test a VST instrument on your desktop, and monitor the audio thru your USB connected mixer to its headphone out, does the audio drop out after a minute or go to static? This can be tested with any VSTi instrument you can put on your desktop and run, selecting your mixer as an ASIO output. Try it and listen if it gets the same result OBS gets.
Frustrating because these low quality computers could be great to make music on but Windows is not designed to prioritize audio (this is what I think the problem is) and they will never be working no matter what you do. I would be open to options to fix the problem but I don't believe this static from interface can be fixed because I have never seen it fixed in 6 years of experiencing it since I first used a Ryzen laptop (Radeon 580 grapics) and had the issues in 2018 and never found any way to fix it. I ran a system process rainmeter skin for most of 2018 and 2019, and found that Microsoft Malware MsMpengine process would trigger the static to come in, which would require the old Fast Track Ultra interface to be power cycled to be fixed.
I think I had similar problems on my NVIDIA 960 and 1060 laptops but it's hard to remember if they were exactly the same.
OK but at least this isn't my main audio computer which has a large Gigabyte RTX GPU and works rock steady for audio all the time.
I'll keep you posted.
Lawrence_SoCal
Active Member
USB spec (especially original 2.0 and earlier 3.x) was for no more than a 6ft cable. There are active cables, quality cables, etc. but if you are over 6ft... definitely start there.
And, yes, a USB hub can be cause of all kinds of issues, especially if mixing different USB speed devices (like 2.0 & 3.x).. If you search on Windows audio subsystem, you will find plenty of discussions here on the limitations of the OS audio architecture (basically isn't designed for quality real-time audio).
If using a DAW, many can't (won't) directly output DAW mixed audio to Windows Audio subsystem (due to issues at Operating System level). A common suggestion with Windows is to use a sound card instead (now, often a USB device, instead of old school PCI cards).
And there is the whole motherboard design, USB Root hub, and USB port consideration (ie, not all ports are the same, even of the same generation... it depends [make/model dependent, no EASY answers]).
So, First, high quality USB cable within spec. Then plug that cable directly into PC (not hub). If Mixer output is USB2, then plug into USB2 port (if you have a spare one).. it depends .. educate yourself on your specific PC (there are chipset implications, and USB connection routing implications), and then test with various ports. If still having an issue, and a modern PC, then getting a quality external USB soundcard (due to electronic noise inside PC, an external sound 'card' is frequently recommended), and plugging mixer into that may help
And, yes, a USB hub can be cause of all kinds of issues, especially if mixing different USB speed devices (like 2.0 & 3.x).. If you search on Windows audio subsystem, you will find plenty of discussions here on the limitations of the OS audio architecture (basically isn't designed for quality real-time audio).
If using a DAW, many can't (won't) directly output DAW mixed audio to Windows Audio subsystem (due to issues at Operating System level). A common suggestion with Windows is to use a sound card instead (now, often a USB device, instead of old school PCI cards).
And there is the whole motherboard design, USB Root hub, and USB port consideration (ie, not all ports are the same, even of the same generation... it depends [make/model dependent, no EASY answers]).
So, First, high quality USB cable within spec. Then plug that cable directly into PC (not hub). If Mixer output is USB2, then plug into USB2 port (if you have a spare one).. it depends .. educate yourself on your specific PC (there are chipset implications, and USB connection routing implications), and then test with various ports. If still having an issue, and a modern PC, then getting a quality external USB soundcard (due to electronic noise inside PC, an external sound 'card' is frequently recommended), and plugging mixer into that may help
This is the sense I getIf you search on Windows audio subsystem, you will find plenty of discussions here on the limitations of the OS audio architecture (basically isn't designed for quality real-time audio).
The OS is just not good for audio. In some cases. I don't know why but Windows I am using is not good on this Mini PC. It is my first experience with this type of computer. Just too bad it doesn't work well with the USB interface. The Audio coming out of the computer to the external stereo (and speakers) works good from a desktop synth. Just doesn't work with the interface.
I see looking at USB Tree Viewer (Uwe Seiber) there are 2 hubs that only use USB 1.1 and 2.0, and have a 'companion port' somehow that is 3.0 enabled. I don't know exactly how that all works, but even though I tried the interface on each of the ports there was no getting rid of the problems.
I will try a shorter cable, and different cables. But I just don't think anything is going to work in my case. I have seen this type of problem before and it never goes away.
Emphasis on *quality* here.a quality external USB soundcard (due to electronic noise inside PC, an external sound 'card' is frequently recommended), and plugging mixer into that may help
The cheap ones use the same chip that is designed to go on the motherboard in that electrically noisy environment, and so their performance isn't any better than that. You really don't gain much from one of those. You do gain *some* by eliminating the noise, but the limit of the chip's performance is not far away.
If you just need a distinct entry in the list of devices, to send an app to and pick up in OBS's Desktop source as a loopback for that one app by itself, then go ahead and use a cheap thing. It doesn't matter for that, because the loopback happens entirely in the OS, well before the chip even sees it. It's only there to add an item to the list, nothing more.
(virtual devices do the same thing without tying up a port, but if you'd rather not install something...)
But if you do use its connection to the outside world, then get something that is actually, intentionally, designed for that purpose. Probably from a well-known brand, and with pro-audio connectors and controls on it.
Lawrence_SoCal
Active Member
Yea, mini PC with everything super tight together (worse than a laptop)... worst electronic noise environment. Issue is likely the Mini PC itself (ie hardware)I don't know why but Windows I am using is not good on this Mini PC.
Time to get some more specific details on your specific make/model MiniPC. Could be a BIOS/driver update required, or a cheap motherboard and won't work for your use case... no way to know from what you've posted so far.I see looking at USB Tree Viewer (Uwe Seiber) there are 2 hubs that only use USB 1.1 and 2.0, and have a 'companion port' somehow that is 3.0 enabled. I don't know exactly how that all works, but even though I tried the interface on each of the ports there was no getting rid of the problems.
Uh,
I will try a shorter cable, and different cables. But I just don't think anything is going to work in my case. I have seen this type of problem before and it never goes away.
Basically, you need to understand the physical path of the USB signal, and its routing on the motherboard (ie direct to CPU, vs chipset, speeds, what else on the USB path, etc). Assuming Mixer output is USB2.0, Ideally, you'd have a CPU connected USB 2.0 port you'd plug into, with everything else using other ports (but that could cause other issues). Presuming electronic noise inside the case is an issue, a QUALITY external USB sound 'card' might help? but it depends.
Unplug all unnecessary USB devices, and limit hub(s). Cheap USB hubs can cause their own problems, especially if combined with cheap motherboard/chipset. You have a multi-variable problem, so true troubleshooting could get tedious and complex
Yeah I've pretty much given up on the computer. It is mostly my TV anyways. It works for Audio but not USB audio. I think you are right. Someone else also suggested this USB being thru the chipset vs the Motherboard or CPU. So I am sure that is what it is and there is no solution in the case of this computer.
Lawrence_SoCal
Active Member
you may not, without detailed troubleshooting, be able to identify if internal USB audio processing is a problem on that MiniPC..Yeah I've pretty much given up on the computer. It is mostly my TV anyways. It works for Audio but not USB audio. I think you are right. Someone else also suggested this USB being thru the chipset vs the Motherboard or CPU. So I am sure that is what it is and there is no solution in the case of this computer.
However, as mentioned previously, even if onboard USB audio processing is a problem, an external sound 'card' (usb adapter) might help... or might not... depends
I pretty much find the option of adding a 'sound card' to my computer has been something I never have done. I found that when trying to make modifications to the innards of a computer or soldering nearly invisible tiny circuits, that I am way out of my comfort range. Maybe I need a magnifying / soldering interface setup. It might be worth investing in but I am pretty sure that is above my pay grade.you may not, without detailed troubleshooting, be able to identify if internal USB audio processing is a problem on that MiniPC..
However, as mentioned previously, even if onboard USB audio processing is a problem, an external sound 'card' (usb adapter) might help... or might not... depends
You don't solder inside a PC. You (power it down first! And then) push a card into an open slot. For the common things, like video, audio, ethernet, WiFi, USB, etc., you "just have that now".I pretty much find the option of adding a 'sound card' to my computer has been something I never have done. I found that when trying to make modifications to the innards of a computer or soldering nearly invisible tiny circuits, that I am way out of my comfort range. Maybe I need a magnifying / soldering interface setup. It might be worth investing in but I am pretty sure that is above my pay grade.
If you don't have an open slot, then you might take something out that you don't actually use, or can reconfigure things to not use. And if you can't remove anything to free up a slot to take over, then you're pretty well stuck. Buy a different PC at that point.
At any rate, no soldering.
Though if the problem is audio, I would *definitely* go with a *good* external USB sound card, and not an internal one. Mostly for noise performance as discussed above.
So if you're adding anything internally, it would be a USB controller to plug the external sound card into, not a sound card directly.
So if you're adding anything internally, it would be a USB controller to plug the external sound card into, not a sound card directly.
Interestingley enough I just today noticed that the FTU8R that I had plugged into the good audio desktop computer I use for all desktop livestreams, was also kicking up static constantly or nearly constantly, while all other sources were good. So although I also have experienced a different M Audio interface on the Mini PC going to static, the FTU8R was going to static even on a good computer system that is real reliable for audio.
The Driver program for that interface is real old. I wonder now if there is any way to upgrade an old driver program to modern system. It is a 64 bit driver, but it's over 10 years old.
The Driver program for that interface is real old. I wonder now if there is any way to upgrade an old driver program to modern system. It is a 64 bit driver, but it's over 10 years old.
Lawrence_SoCal
Active Member
No, not what I meant... if something internal on motherboard the issue, resolving it directly is not something I'd pursue (except if I was in some isolated place with not hope of re-supply for years type situation, and had full electronics lab... and someone (not me) who knew what they were doing...). bye troubleshooting I was meaning scientific method of isolating variables to confirm noise source (not messing with motherboard, or adding electronic noise isolation/filtering (most likely a lost cause if not designed in up front)I pretty much find the option of adding a 'sound card' to my computer has been something I never have done. I found that when trying to make modifications to the innards of a computer or soldering nearly invisible tiny circuits, that I am way out of my comfort range.
Though some troubleshooting advisable to avoid circumstance where you buy and install an external quality external USB Sound ('card) adapter and still have issue if problem isn't the computer, but something else (noise on electrical power source, cable connections, interference on unshielded cables, etc)
Lawrence_SoCal
Active Member
I doubt its a computer driver issue. FAR more likely its the device itself (or the environment).. but hard to know without testingInterestingley enough I just today noticed that the FTU8R that I had plugged into the good audio desktop computer I use for all desktop livestreams, was also kicking up static constantly or nearly constantly, while all other sources were good. So although I also have experienced a different M Audio interface on the Mini PC going to static, the FTU8R was going to static even on a good computer system that is real reliable for audio.
The Driver program for that interface is real old. I wonder now if there is any way to upgrade an old driver program to modern system. It is a 64 bit driver, but it's over 10 years old.
I've seen plenty of corporate data closets, and House of Worship music stations ;^) that have a rats nest of (data, audio, and power) cables; and daisy-chained cheap power strips. All recipes for electronic noise. Could be failing power supply on the FTU8R, or its device circuit board having a problem {solder connection, failed chip, noise on 1 cable, etc. ) OR... the list goes on and on with LOTS and LOTS of possibilities