Help needed! I think?

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geddron1976

New Member
Hi all! I have been noticing some issues that i believe aren't quite right with my obs capturing..

I have dual mics set up for recording my singing videos for youtube and i have noticed that on the mixer feature in obs, when i play audio from the computer, the sound levels are showing on the meters for audio output capture, but also showing on the audio input devices (mics) levels aswell?

Is this normal or have i got the settings incorrect?

I would have thought that playing audio from the pc should only show up in the audio output level and not the mics? i have tried whilst using the mics and also while switching the mics off aswell and the meters are still showing the audio levels from the audio output being metered on the mic level channels.

can someone let me know if this is normal or if i have to change the settings on the obs to seperate the inputs etc.

I use a steinberg ur242 audio interface to route my audio and mic capture to obs. everything seems to be getting captured but i am not sure if this is how it should be working or if i have somehow messed up the settings..

i'd be really grateful for some help with this asap..

thanks in advance for your help!
 
A

AaronD

Active Member
geddron1976 said:
when i play audio from the computer, the sound levels are showing on the meters for audio output capture, but also showing on the audio input devices (mics) levels aswell?

I would have thought that playing audio from the pc should only show up in the audio output level and not the mics?
Click to expand...
Welcome to live sound! Every mic captures everything in the room, and there's nothing you can do to prevent it. You can only change the *amount* of each thing that each mic picks up, by choosing a mic with a useful pickup pattern and then using that pattern intentionally.

Nulls - which are the direction(s) where it *doesn't* pick up - are often more useful than the forward direction - which is the direction where it's intended to pick up. Point the nulls at the worst offenders, like speakers, and keep that while you also point the forward direction towards your intended source. If you've seen a stage performance that has floor wedge speakers, and the mics are on stands (at least to start with), you might also notice that the vocal mics are all pointed either directly away from them or they're at a specific angle. That puts the null of those mics right on those speakers. Straight or angle depends on the mic itself.

Baffles can be useful too. Put something solid between the mic and the worst offenders. The small plexiglass circles that you might have seen around an otherwise-open drum kit are called "shy baffles", and their entire purpose is to keep the cymbals out of the vocal mics.

Neither of those solutions is perfect - nothing is - but now the sound has to travel a much greater distance to get into the mic - reflecting off of something and coming in from a direction that the mic doesn't ignore - and it gets weaker the whole way. Padding the walls, and any other hard surface, helps reduce those reflections...
 
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geddron1976

New Member
AaronD said:
Welcome to live sound! Every mic captures everything in the room, and there's nothing you can do to prevent it. You can only change the *amount* of each thing that each mic picks up, by choosing a mic with a useful pickup pattern and then using that pattern intentionally.

Nulls - which are the direction(s) where it *doesn't* pick up - are often more useful than the forward direction - which is the direction where it's intended to pick up. Point the nulls at the worst offenders, like speakers, and keep that while you also point the forward direction towards your intended source. If you've seen a stage performance that has floor wedge speakers, and the mics are on stands (at least to start with), you might also notice that the vocal mics are all pointed either directly away from them or they're at a specific angle. That puts the null of those mics right on those speakers. Straight or angle depends on the mic itself.

Baffles can be useful too. Put something solid between the mic and the worst offenders. The small plexiglass circles that you might have seen around an otherwise-open drum kit are called "shy baffles", and their entire purpose is to keep the cymbals out of the vocal mics.

Neither of those solutions is perfect - nothing is - but now the sound has to travel a much greater distance to get into the mic - reflecting off of something and coming in from a direction that the mic doesn't ignore - and it gets weaker the whole way. Padding the walls, and any other hard surface, helps reduce those reflections...
Click to expand...
Sorry, but i think you have misunderstood the issue i am having.. the mics aren't picking up any sound from the speakers at all.

I use headphones and even without the volume completely turned off, the issues are still there. It isn't a point of audio being fed back through the microphones, it is an issue with the set up.
The audio from the pc like for example a backing track which is being played, it is being routed somehow through the microphone levels on the mixer in obs.
If i simply play the backing track with no volume through the speakers or headphones, the levels are seen moving on the mic channels, identical to the audio output and desktop audio.
I seem to have set it up incorrectly or changed something accidentally that has caused this problem.. i feel it is definitely something to do with the audio routing, but i can't seem to find a way to alter it that has any effect.
 
A

AaronD

Active Member
Draw a diagram of how it's supposed to work, then look through ALL of the settings and draw another diagram of how it actually works.

If anything uses Default, change it to the specific device that it's supposed to be, and try again. Default is a semi-random selection of device, according to the whims of the operating system. Never use Default for anything.
 
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geddron1976

New Member
AaronD said:
Draw a diagram of how it's supposed to work, then look through ALL of the settings and draw another diagram of how it actually works.

If anything uses Default, change it to the specific device that it's supposed to be, and try again. Default is a semi-random selection of device, according to the whims of the operating system. Never use Default for anything.
Click to expand...
i have realised how little i know about the entire setup... i can't fathom what is wrong, or even if it is wrong.. i do believe though that the desktop audio shouldnt really be affecting the meters for the audio input. but it's working and recording ok, so i guess if it isn't broken, no point fixing it!
 
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AaronD

Active Member
Probably the best thing for my understanding, was to build some analog sound systems for low-budget concerts and things. When you do that, you have a collection of separate boxes that each do something specific and nothing else, and you explicitly make all of the connections that you want between them. Then you run a concert on it and see the deficiencies. Next time, you do it differently to fix those deficiencies, etc.

Watch a bunch of YouTubes from different people to see how to use the gear that you have and what you might want to add next and, more importantly, why. Until you understand what you have though, you really shouldn't add to or upgrade it. Learn what you've got first, and make it sing, so that you're *qualified* to make that decision.

See if you can arrange a way to iterate a bunch of times like that. Keep it analog for a while so you can see directly what connects to where and why, and if something's not needed you can physically unplug it, or just know that you're not going to use it for this show.

Churches and non-profits are likely to be more welcoming than commercial operations, but you'll probably always be a volunteer there, not paid. This is a standalone youth ministry that I did after countless rigs before it:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
www.youtube.com www.youtube.com

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
www.youtube.com www.youtube.com
40-channel analog console, plus 8 compressors on the side to allocate wisely (OBS has a compressor plugin that does the same thing), plus 24-track recorder, plus a few other things, all connected by the patchbay that looks like a ratsnest, but that's only because the patch cords are way too long for where they connect at the moment.
6kW tops, 6kW subs, tuned for equal headroom with the board, meaning that the board's meter also tells me how the PA is doing. I can hit 100dBA on the floor quite easily, and still sound good. You don't need digital for that. :-)

The entire purpose of the patchbay is to make the rear connections accessible while keeping everything in place, and it took about 5 full evenings after work to hand-solder. You can skip the soldering part if you buy pre-made patchbays that have jacks on the back too, and another full set of cords to go behind. But you probably won't get to that point for a while if you're just starting. Keep it small and relatively limited, learn that, then go from there.
 
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AaronD

Active Member
Then once you understand how audio signalling works, you can look for the same sort of thing in digital systems, like a digital console, or Windows' audio settings. :-/
 
L

Lawrence_SoCal

Active Member
geddron1976 said:
i do believe though that the desktop audio shouldnt really be affecting the meters for the audio input.
Click to expand...
I would NOT assume that. it depends on Operating System Config + OBS Studio config
Personally, as in my use cases it ONLY causes problems, I disabled Desktop Audio (and all the other Global Audio devices in OBS Studio Settings)
geddron1976 said:
but it's working and recording ok, so i guess if it isn't broken, no point fixing it!
Click to expand...
depends....
If you set up a separate Audio Input source = mics, and any backing audio is its own Media Source in OBS Studio (not coming in via Desktop Audio), and you've Muted/'turned off' Desktop Audio in the Source list... then meter indication on Desktop Audio wouldn't matter (as it isn't going anywhere in OBS).... but... it depends

As Aaron indicated. .. start with the diagrams. And after documenting, that, then follow the pinned post in this forum about posting your OBS Studio log, so we can view your settings to advise further. But... the log without an understanding of physical audio routing, audio interface/mixer settings, and Operating System and driver audio settings is largely pointless as the whole point is to configure OBS Studio Audio settings to work with the rest of the environment (which the OBS logs don't capture)... which means outside real obvious "oops'es", hard to comment on OBS settings without knowing the other half of the equation
geddron1976 said:
I have dual mics set up for recording my singing videos for youtube and i have noticed that on the mixer feature in obs, when i play audio from the computer, the sound levels are showing on the meters for audio output capture, but also showing on the audio input devices (mics) levels aswell?
Click to expand...

1. Do you have Audio Output Capture as a Source? if yes, why? [sorry, I'm sick, apologies in advance if brain fog means I'm missing the obvious]
2. As for Audio inputs... it depends. do you have both Mic Input and backing audio on a combined Audio Input (like Desktop Audio?)
Years ago, I found these OBS Audio related articles helpful. Maybe they'll help you with some of the basics
 
G

geddron1976

New Member
Lawrence_SoCal said:
I would NOT assume that. it depends on Operating System Config + OBS Studio config
Personally, as in my use cases it ONLY causes problems, I disabled Desktop Audio (and all the other Global Audio devices in OBS Studio Settings)

depends....
If you set up a separate Audio Input source = mics, and any backing audio is its own Media Source in OBS Studio (not coming in via Desktop Audio), and you've Muted/'turned off' Desktop Audio in the Source list... then meter indication on Desktop Audio wouldn't matter (as it isn't going anywhere in OBS).... but... it depends

As Aaron indicated. .. start with the diagrams. And after documenting, that, then follow the pinned post in this forum about posting your OBS Studio log, so we can view your settings to advise further. But... the log without an understanding of physical audio routing, audio interface/mixer settings, and Operating System and driver audio settings is largely pointless as the whole point is to configure OBS Studio Audio settings to work with the rest of the environment (which the OBS logs don't capture)... which means outside real obvious "oops'es", hard to comment on OBS settings without knowing the other half of the equation


1. Do you have Audio Output Capture as a Source? if yes, why? [sorry, I'm sick, apologies in advance if brain fog means I'm missing the obvious]
2. As for Audio inputs... it depends. do you have both Mic Input and backing audio on a combined Audio Input (like Desktop Audio?)
Years ago, I found these OBS Audio related articles helpful. Maybe they'll help you with some of the basics
Click to expand...
My setup is pretty simple. I have my pc, this has a steinberg UR242 audio interface connected to it via USB. The interface has 2 XLR mic inputs and each mic is plugged in to those inputs.
The audio interface has a software called UR242 FX which allows me to add reverb etc to the mic output channels.
The interface also (as far as i am aware) replaces the pc internal audio card and routes all the audio through the interface.
so from what i understand, the pc audio runs through the interface and then mixed with the mic channels before being routed back in to the pc for either streaming or recording as mp4 files to my pc.

I do have audio output capture as a source, i believed that to be the combined audio of the 3 channels that is being recorded on the pc. so figured i needed it for the audio volume control in the obs mixer?
do i need the audio output capture active?

I did use a youtube video to setup the obs in the first instance, i guess i hadn't noticed the input levels showing on the mic channels on playback.
I may need to mention that i need to use the loopback feature in the UR242 interface in order for the pc audio to be heard when streaming..
 
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AaronD

Active Member
I wonder if your interface has its own loopback switch? I have no idea how that would be useful, since pretty much every host PC has that exact function already, but a fair number of interfaces do have it.
 
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