Question / Help Need advice for an excellent image quality 1080p live output camera

[Roy777]

Hello friends,

I'm not sure this is the right place to ask but I didn't find a better category.
I'm looking for a live output camera to record together with my computer screen in OBS like when streaming but actually only recording and not streaming. I want to do this together and live so I will not need to edit the files afterwards, to sync them, encode them, etc'..

So I'm looking for an excellent image quality camera, with these requirements:

1. a Full HD Resolution as sometimes I'll want to have the camera output on the whole screen (could be higher resolution but I wont use it)

2. A quality sensor that would give an image quality of a good DSLR (equivalent to a cropped sensor DSLR at least), I'm looking for a "Studio" quality video, like the good video quality of product reviews you can find on youtube etc'. a webcam wont cut it, I'm looking for much better quality (I know I also need good quality lighting and have it already).

3. Does NOT have the 29 minutes video recording limitation of a DSLR.

4. A TRUE 1080p clean live output. an HDMI cable into a DSLR will mostly not output true high quality 1080p as when it captures to card. those outputs are mostly for monitoring purposes only. I've verified that fact thoroughly in a few sources and I also have a good quality Canon DSLR camera which I can get nice video from by recording onto the SD card but not through it's HDMI output which shows poor video compared to the recorded one (grainy, artifacts, low frame rate etc').

5. Not more expensive than about $1000 (hopefully less)

I am looking into prosumer level camcorders but they're mostly expensive and have many features I don't need and their live output quality through HDMI is also always in doubt and needs to be checked and verified with the manufacturer.

If you can recommend any other camera that could fit my needs, I'll be grateful.

Many Thanks in advance!

Roy.

 

[Roy777]

Anyone? please? (:

 

[Dihelson]

Hello friends,

I'm not sure this is the right place to ask but I didn't find a better category.
I'm looking for a live output camera to record together with my computer screen in OBS like when streaming but actually only recording and not streaming. I want to do this together and live so I will not need to edit the files afterwards, to sync them, encode them, etc'..

So I'm looking for an excellent image quality camera, with these requirements:

1. a Full HD Resolution as sometimes I'll want to have the camera output on the whole screen (could be higher resolution but I wont use it)

2. A quality sensor that would give an image quality of a good DSLR (equivalent to a cropped sensor DSLR at least), I'm looking for a "Studio" quality video, like the good video quality of product reviews you can find on youtube etc'. a webcam wont cut it, I'm looking for much better quality (I know I also need good quality lighting and have it already).

3. Does NOT have the 29 minutes video recording limitation of a DSLR.

4. A TRUE 1080p clean live output. an HDMI cable into a DSLR will mostly not output true high quality 1080p as when it captures to card. those outputs are mostly for monitoring purposes only. I've verified that fact thoroughly in a few sources and I also have a good quality Canon DSLR camera which I can get nice video from by recording onto the SD card but not through it's HDMI output which shows poor video compared to the recorded one (grainy, artifacts, low frame rate etc').

5. Not more expensive than about $1000 (hopefully less)

I am looking into prosumer level camcorders but they're mostly expensive and have many features I don't need and their live output quality through HDMI is also always in doubt and needs to be checked and verified with the manufacturer.

If you can recommend any other camera that could fit my needs, I'll be grateful.

Many Thanks in advance!

Roy.

The camera you are seeking is the Canon SL2 or SL3. They are the best and affordable cameras for live stream these days. They have 1080p clean output via HDMI, they have APS-C sensor size, the same size of most Canon DSLR cameras like T7i and 80D. You can turn off the power saving mode, so the camera won't turn off after 30 minutes. You can use the whole set of EF-S and EF Canon lenses with it. Indeed, the kit lens is reasonable, 18-55mm. It's affordable, has everything we need to broadcast, even a flip screen. You then output the camera HDMI signal to a capture device like we elgato USB stick, or some blackmagic shuttle USB 3.0 or if on a desktop, you may use a PCI Express capture card like Avermedia or a blackmagic card. You will get the cleanest 1080p video you can get. It's what tons of youtubers are suggesting these days. You don't need a fancy expensive camera for that. If you want something cheaper but worse, you can purchase Logitech Brio. It's a good webcam, but it doesn't deliver a professional quality of SL2 or SL3. BTW the basic difference from these cameras is that SL3 has eye detection, a way too good for autofocus. But when broadcasting, we often don't need it. Indeed many times it's better to disable autofocus, so SL2 is the way to go. Good luck.

 

[Roy777]

@Dihelson

OMG... I didn't log back in to see if I got a reply and kept investigating so much on my own coming to the same SL3 conclusion!! it wasn't easy! I could save myself so much time... my investigation started with finding out which DSLR surely has a clean and quality HDMI output, then I got to 90D which does and found out that the M6 mark ii and the SL3 have the same specs, but the SL3 is so inexpensive and about half the price, but there wasn't a lot of information about it or youtube videos where I could see portrait video shots taken with it, so for who's ever is interested in more info, I've ran into these 2 very important youtube videos which have ruled it out for me:

New FaceCam | Canon SL3 + CamLink (fast forward to 7:46 see the quality).
How I Used the Canon SL3 with the Elgato Cam Link!

Thank you so so much taking the time to answer me and for all the other tips they are very very helpful to me as I'm also looking for a capture card.

About the SL2, there is not much of a price difference in my country compared to the SL3 so I think I'll go for it.

Thanks again,

Roy.

 

[FerretBomb]

I would also recommend looking into the Sony a5100. It's much lower-cost than the SL3; under 2/3rds the price even with a kit lens, and is the go-to entry level DSLR for many Twitch streamers looking to upgrade their face-cam. Does clean HDMI out, 1080p60, and is small and lightweight... barely bigger than the lens itself.

The only drawback is that if you record to the internal SD card, it will overheat in around 10 minutes due to thermal issues. But that's only when running the camera's video encoder to record to the SD card. If you're just using the HDMI out, I have run it for 36+ hours straight with no thermal issues. I've also been using it for more than a year with no sensor problems, and it's APS-C as well.

You do need to run it in Movie mode to enable high-quality HDMI output (for some reason picture mode delivers degraded quality) and there's a firmware bug that Sony refuses to acknowledge or fix that forces skin smoothing on unless recording internally... or zoomed in, even just slightly. I do the latter as I dislike the skin smoothing it uses... makes me look waxy and unnatural. You also need a battery replacer kit to run it from wall power while using the camera (which is pretty standard for DSLRs, for whatever reason) but those are pretty cheap.

 

[Roy777]

@FerretBomb Thanks so much for your input as well! and for all the info.. It's good to know and I was checking it out as well.
I might go with the SL3, mainly because of the Canon lenses options.

Thanks so much again!

Roy.

 

[Roy777]

@Dihelson Did you mean that PCI express cards such as Blackmagic and Avermedia give better quality than an adapter like an Elgato CamLink? if not, do you think that a Razer Ripsaw HD could give great quality too? I could get it in a really good price..

@FerretBomb would love your 2 cents about this too :)

 

[Dihelson]

@Dihelson Did you mean that PCI express cards such as Blackmagic and Avermedia give better quality than an adapter like an Elgato CamLink? if not, do you think that a Razer Ripsaw HD could give great quality too? I could get it in a really good price..

@FerretBomb would love your 2 cents about this too :)

I can't compare my PCI Express blackmagic and Avermedia with camlink because I haven't tested. I know that my PCI cards are more solid than even the blackmagic USB 3.0 cards, which sometimes presents some stutters.

 

[Roy777]

@Dihelson Thanks for your reply, interesting, so you have both blackmagic and Avermedia? :) which models? if they are so solid I would love to check them out.

 

[FerretBomb]

The Razer Ripsaw HD is literally just an Avermedia LiveGamer Extreme 2 in a different Razer-branded plastic case. It'll work fine, but I'd recommend searching a bit... they're kind of known for having weird problems.

Internal capture cards are absolutely the way to go if possible. It gives them direct PCIe bus access, so they don't have to go through the USB Host Controller bottleneck, and can't choke out bandwidth for other devices on your USB host (as video takes a lot of throughput). Currently for futureproofing, I'd recommend looking at the Elgato 4K60 Pro Mk.2; it has a lot of advantages. If you can go all-out, take a peek at the card I'm using; the Magewell ProCapture Dual HDMI. 1080p60, but allows one port for your DSLR facecam, and one to hook up a game console. Works the best out of a ton of capture cards I've worked with, and even if it's expensive as heck, if mine broke I'd be buying another one same-day.

 

[Dihelson]

@Dihelson Thanks for your reply, interesting, so you have both blackmagic and Avermedia? :) which models? if they are so solid I would love to check them out.

I have blackmagic 4k PCI Express, blackmagic decklink ( only one input maximum 1080 ), and Avermedia PCI Express, can't remember exactly the version, but it goes up to 1080p only. The USB 3.0 I was referring is blackmagic shuttle USB 3.0. It's also very good, but I trust PCI directly.

 

[Roy777]

@Dihelson That's cool.. @FerretBomb That's cool too and your card looks crazy.. and way out of my budget :) I also only need 1 HDMI input..

Thank you both so much for your advice.. you've sent me on a quest :)

I might need to capture my screen at 60fps, I'll need to test, if I could settle for 30fps it would probably be much better for saving up on resources and I also don't know what fps rate i'll get from the HDMI output of the camera I'll be getting (also not sure it matters), but if it does, I might need to record or pass through 60fps through the card to have the same frame rate in OBS? (camera input overlaid over the desktop capture).

so I've narrowed it down to two PCI cards that could record/pass 1080p @60fps, the Blackmagic Design Intensity Pro 4K and the AVerMedia Live Gamer HD 2 .

I tend towards the blackmagic although some people wrote in their reviews that the fan is very noisy, someone said that it's not noisy and that it's perfect, eventually it might be that it was the first drivers which were the issue and it was solved later on by updating them.
@Dihelson Is that the card you have? if so, is it noisy? the blackmagic:

• comes bundled with DaVinci Resolve which separately costs $300 (which is pretty awesome but I'm not sure I'll need it) and more software
• can take 10 bit video, which the camera i'll probably get does have it, again not sure if it matters and if it's of use.
• has analog inputs to be able to record VHS tapes. but that's just a bonus.

I'm just "scared" of the noise.. I really don't like noisy components.. the Avermedia doesn't have a fan..

Which one would you recommend? :) Thanks so so much again!

Roy.

 

[FerretBomb]

Initially the BMIP4K sounded like a dustbuster. People said that the fan speed issue was fixed with a firmware update, but I have not heard any post-fix samples from owners.

Between the two, I'd go for the BMIP4K. Straight-up a better unit. It's internal, plus it has a breakout for analog inputs if you feel like playing any retro consoles that don't have HDMI as an option. Especially if you find a cheap Camlink down the line to take over facecam duties, you won't have wasted money. And if the fan is too loud, you can return the card to Amazon. I had to do that as I'd initially gone for the 4-port Magewell (with fans) and had to send it back. Minor hassle, but no lost money.

 

[Roy777]

Thank you @FerretBomb :) yeah I tend to go with the blackmagic one as it offers much more value with the software and analog inputs, not sure about the noise with recent firmware too but the fan and heatsink on it really does look terrible as this guy took it apart and installed another one instead.. not the best looking work but I could hack and fix something similar as well :) Thank you.

 

[Fenrir]

I have a newer-revision BMIP4K, I can't hear it even when it's in use for hours. Have not had any issues with it, would also recommend.

 

[Roy777]

@Fenrir Thank you for your input, that's good to hear, is there a way you know of to tell which is a newer revision?

@FerretBomb Some people say it's only a capture card and that it doesn't have an encoder built in to it like the game capture cards, If I want to have my camera's video overlaid on the desktop capture in OBS and only recording not streaming, is it ok that the card doesn't have an encoder on it? or a card with an encoder would make things work better?

Thanks a lot for your help.

 

[FerretBomb]

Having an encoder on the card will not help. The encoders on things like AverMedia or Elgato capture cards use very low-end hardware encoders that OBS cannot access anyway, only their own proprietary streaming software can, and look like garbage.
Not having an encoder on it is like not having a racing stripe on your car, when it comes to OBS.

 

[Roy777]

Having an encoder on the card will not help. The encoders on things like AverMedia or Elgato capture cards use very low-end hardware encoders that OBS cannot access anyway, only their own proprietary streaming software can, and look like garbage.
Not having an encoder on it is like not having a racing stripe on your car, when it comes to OBS.

Thanks for the valuable info.. can't thank you enough..